tv The Last Word MSNBC December 5, 2012 7:00pm-8:00pm PST
protestors that keeps their bellies well-fed and keeps their dreams alive. pizza pulleys. tonight's moment of geek. that does it for us tonight and he'll see you weekend morning at 8:00 eastern. this weekend i welcome dan savidge to talk about guyç marriage in washington. it's time for the last word with lawrence o'donnell. have a great night. we don't know what john boehner said to the president on the phone today, but we do know that boehner is finally admitting defeat on one thing. the rich will have to pay more. >> the next 72 hours are critical. >> will republicans cry uncle? both sides are still locked in a stalemate. >> there's plenty of hot rhetoric to go around. >> both sides are coming out swinging. . >> raising tax rates will hurt the economy. >> i will not play that game.
>> president obama standing his ground. >> i will not play that game. >> he's not willing to play that game. >> playing the smackdown. >> i think the president has boxed the republicans in. >> i know we have it to raise revenue. >> is he the only republican? >> i don't care how we do it. >> raising tax rates hurt the economy. >> let's just go over the [ bleep ] cliff. >> if they do not make this deal on tax rates for the top 2%, then they're going away. >> i just hope this doesn't become a game of chicken. >> i will not play that game. >> it goes into february and march. >> public opinion is on their side. >> when we have to raise the debt ceiling. >> i will not play that game. >> this is about gaining maximum leverage. >> we've gone through this before. >> some republicans believe that will give them more leverage. >> it's government at the brink all the time. >> these guys are not serious about negotiating.ç >> the next 72 hours are critical. >> i think we're going over the cliff. >> let's just go over the [ bleep ] cliff. >> let's go over the cliff. >> at least for a few seconds it
will feel like we're flying. >> with 26 days to go until america goes off the fiscal curb, the house of representatives chose to end their congressional business for the week today to enjoy a long weekend at home, but john boehner stayed behind and spoke by phone this afternoon to president obama. it was their first conversation in a week. also, this afternoon treasury secretary tim geithner said this on cnbc. >> when it comes to raising taxes on the wealthy, those making more than $250,000, if republicans do not agree to that, is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> absolutely. again, there's no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve the rates going up on the top 2%. >> "the new york times" reports that senior republican leadership aides are
contemplating a fall-back position on a fiscal deal. they could foresee taking up and passing legislation this month to extend the tax cuts for the middle class and then resume the bitter fight over spending and taxes as the nation approaches the next hard deadline. it's statutory borrowingç limi which could be reached in late january or february. speaking to a business roundtable, president obama responded to that idea this way. >> if congress in any way suggests that they're going to tie negotiations to debt ceiling votes and take us to the brink of default once again, as part of a budget negotiation, which by the way we have never done in our history until we did this it last year, i will not play that game. >> john boehner and house republican leadership met with small business owners today to talk about the fiscal cliff, raising tax rates on the richest
americans for them is still off the table. >> the revenues on the table are coming from, guess who? the rich. there are ways to limit deductions, close loopholes, and have the same people pay more of their money to the federal government without raising tax rates, which we believe will harm our economy. if the president doesn't agree with our proposal and our outline, i think he's got an obligation to send one to the congress. a plan that can pass both chambers of congress. >> joining me now is former vermont governor howard dean and msnbc's krystal ball. governor dean, our treasury secretary is a very carwful speaker. when asked if they're prepared to go off the cliff, his first word was absolutely. there was nothing, nothing could be more clear that this administration means what they
say about getting what they want at this point. >> yeah. the only problem is -- this is a little initially going to team like heresy, the truth is everybody needs to pay more taxes, not just the rich. that's a good start. we won't get out of the problem to raise taxes across the board to go back to what bill clinton had in his taxes. if we don't do that, the problem is pressure is on spending even more. i think we need to make the defense cuts. we want to minimize human services cuts. the best way to do that is go back to clinton era taxes. i actually have mixed feelings about striking a deal where the rich folks pay more taxes. i think they should pay more taxes, but i actually think going off clithe cliff is a bet solution than just charging people who make a lot of money what they were paying when bill clinton was president. >> the clinton tax rates worked
well, and when you look at where we really are today, although the democrats are playing really tough on these top tax rates, they have conceded about 75% of the tax debate to republicans by agreeing with them on all of the otherç rates. >> that is true, aalthough there is a matter of timing. you know, i think part of what you have to look at here is it's really hrepublicans who force this conversation about having deficit reduction right now. we shouldn't have deficit reduction right now. we should focus on jobs and employment and continued stimulus for the economy, which i was really happy about the president at least had some of that in his plan. then you ask yourself, okay, what could you do in terms of reducing the deficit that would be the least damaging, and what economists say and what makes common sense is people at the top end of the income scale, who can afford to pay a little more, that's the place where we can raise the rates now and not have a major economic impact. so i take the governor's point,
and i agree with it. we probably are going to -- if we're going to continue to make the promises and keep the promises that i think are so important and most progressives do, we probably need to raise taxes on a lot of people. it's a question of timing of when to make those choices. >> the rush limbaugh showed us today how difficult it is for john boehner and eric cantor to make the moves they've already made. let's listen to what rush said. >> what we got today was a seminar on how to surrender. obama is going to get what he wants. we're using his language. we're now calling new taxes revenues. we have accepted the premise that new revenues will resultçn greater tax receipts going forward. they must feel so squished, so defeated, so universally
disliked. >> governor dean, they're still far apart, democrats and republicans, but it's worth pointing out how far the democrats have moved since the election it to where they are today. they left that rush limbaugh thinking far behind. >> it's a good thing, because rush limbaugh is nowhere near the mainstream of the american people. i'm also worried about the defense cuts. i think we need to make the cuts. we haven't cut the defense budget much in the last 30 years. they just ordered new uniforms for their chauffeurs for the top brass. you know, this is going to be a lost opportunity if there's too much compromising going on here. i'm going to stick to my position we'd be off going over the cliff, the curb. it's a slope and not a cliff. i take krystal's point as a good point. you have to pick your time. the europeans are done too much
with austerity. i think we can afford to do this, and we ought to make the down payment. the cliff doesn't fix the deficit, but it really does make a downpayment and gets defense cuts for the first time. you know damn well the defense won't get cut ifç they make a deal on this. >> in the "new york post" today a conservative columnist wrote the trut is every way you look at it, the gop is trapped. republican politicians will save and give the president most of of what he wants. the only real question is when. the answer is probably at the worst possible time when they've done even more damage to the party's brand. it seems to me from the perspective he doesn't specify the worst possible time will be after they drive the thing off the cliff. if they're going to do this, they should do it before christmas and go home. >> i think you're right. we've seen tom cole and others starting to say, you know what,
guys? maybe we should go along with the obama plan to extend the rates for the middle class and deal with the rest after the new year. that probably is their best play at this point, because that's such a damaging political point. people understand that republicans are holding the middle class tax cuts hostage in order to fight for tax cuts for this very small percent of the population, and that's politically devastating. if you look at the position boehner's in, it's remarkable in a way that he's already admitted that we have to raise revenues on the wealthiest individuals, and that hasn't come without a price. you already see on the right between that and his movements of some committee members assignments that there is a mini rebellion starting on the right. the hash tag fireboehner is takingç off. this is something he has to watch. the compromise is not his initial starting position, which is already unacceptable to people like jim demint and others. >> governor dean, if you looked at this from the republican perspective and you go with what
horowitz's presumption they're going to cave on rates at some point and go along with it, would you advise them politically the sooner the better? get this off the doorstep. >> they need to do that. had they not taken such extreme positions mitt romney might have done a lot better. i think the president is in command here. they're not going to beat him on this one. they'll make themselves look bad. i think they do, and if i were them i would do what boehner is talking about. here's the other problem, though. if boehner is not going to get the 60 or 70 tea party people, so he has to get some democrats. i don't think he can get democrats if they do something like try to raise the age of medicare or something like that. eligibility for medicare. that is a no-go zone for any reasonable, respectable democrat. this is not even. even if boehner caves, he can't bring his caucus with him. he has to deal with nancy pelosi
one way or another. >> howard dean and krystal ball, thank you both for joining me tonight. >> thanks. >> coming up, there is a sleeping giant in the tax policy issues facing the president and congress, and no one is talking about it yet. another republican is takingç shots at mitt romney, and this time of all people it's paul ryan. and also coming up, marijuana, marriage, hillary clinton, seceding from the union and gangham style are all in the rewrite. ♪ well, having a ton of locations doesn't hurt. and a santa to boot! [ chuckles ] right, baby. oh, sir. that is a customer. oh...sorry about that. [ male announcer ] break from the holiday stress. fedex office. [ male announcer ] jill and her mouth have lived
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tend to weigh less than those who don't. [ traffic passing ] ] ♪ [ music box: lullaby ] [ man on tv, indistinct ] ♪ [ lullaby continues ] [ baby coos ] [ man announcing ] millions are still exposed to the dangers... of secondhand smoke... and some of them can't do anything about it. ♪ [ continues ] [ gasping ] republicans used to think it was wrong for americans making money it to pay no income tax. republicans supported a version of the buffett rule before anyone heard of warren buffett.
that's coming up. and washington is turning to gangham style politics, and that's in the rewrite. how did i do with that? >> it was good. it was good. >> what is your new fancy title at the çshow? >> digital producer. >> and the people are americanizing this pronunciation, and it's wrong. what's the wrong pronunciation. >> gangham. you didn't say it that way, which is good. >> i said it the right way? >> you said it the right way. >> stand by. we'll have to do more of this in the show. just like an officer helps a captain explore the universe, zeebox helps you discover what shows are most popular, where the biggest buzz is, or what the stars are watching now. download zeebox free, and let your tv go where it's never gone before. (announcer) when subaru owners look in the mirror, they see more than themselves. so we celebrate our year-end with the "share the love" event.
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paid i find to be very small-minlded compared to the broad issues that we face, but i did go back and look at my taxes. over the past ten years i never paid less than 13%. i think the most recent year is 13.6% or something like that. >> 13%. you know who would hate that? you know who would hate that mitt romney paid only 13% in income taxes? the guy who beat mitt romney's father in the campaign for president in 1968, right wing reactionary richard nixon. that's right. republican richard nixon who was as conservative as republicans got in those days hated the idea that rich people got away with paying little or no income taxes. he introduced a bill that would create a minimum tax that rich people would have to pay even if they had the giant package of deductions and loopholes like romney that got their tax liability down to zero.
they had to pay something. the nixon idea was there's a basic minimum to pay no matter what their deductions say. the idea was called the alternative minimum tax, and richard nixon signed it into law inç 1969 saying a large numberf high-income persons who paid little or no federal income taxes will now bear a fairer share of the tax burden through enactment of a minimum income tax comparable to the proposal i submitted to the congress which closes the loopholes that permitted much of this tax avoidance. the trouble with the amt, which is now 43 years old, is unlike regular income tax brackets it hasn't been indexed for inflation. as it holds its position in the tax code, it starts to affect more and more taxpayers as incomes rise with inflation over time. congress has historically fixed this will little problem one year at a time.
not surprisingly this congress has not yet gotten around to fixing the amt for tax year 2012 and the amt fix is now the sleeping giant in the fiscal cliff budget negotiations that as of this hour are still focused entirely on income tax rates. there is much more that congress has to solve than income tax rates including the amt, medicare spending, medicaid, and possibly social security. joining me to talk about the things that congress is not yet talking about but will soon be talking about, joeyç reed and chris hayes. chris, the amt has a deadline to it that is sharper than anything else in here, because these 2012 tax returns going to have to be calculated with either this new version of the amt or the fixed version, and that is the difference between it affects --
it adds tens of millions of people getting bitten by this thing. i know that the insiders are more worried about that actually getting fixed than the cliff at this point. >> yeah. when i started covering capitol hill in washington, there were two things that people talked about, which was the amt patch and the dock fix. everyone is like where are we on the amt fix. they adjust the payments and do this thing with the amt. we were asking early on, is there a way? this seems like a strange way to legislation the things. when you look at the difference between the baseline, which is current law and policy, aa lot is the wedge between those two things. there's an assumption every year it will get fixed. the big question after the debt ceiling is the assumption things get fixed because they have in the past, is that now a tenable or plausible assumption going forward because we have entered new territory in the post-debt
ceiling era. >> it will affect 28 million people if they don't fix it. the reason they don't fix them long-term is it budgetarilyç costs a massive amount of money to do it. >> it's ridiculous. >> it's the reason bush's tax cuts had this ten-year sunset on it. in the budget windows, it goes on forever. they couldn't afford it. they do this year to year. but this is going to be -- everything else you can fix retro actively. trying to unwind this amt problem if you don't have it fixed by new year's eve or in the first couple of days of january, it becomes a nightmare. >> yeah, and for people who do their own taxes, can you imagine the software makers to reconfigure how to do it. >> you can't do anything. >> it's insane. when nixon signed this it was based on a report that 155 people didn't pay taxes. a small number of people created these things. >> these are people making
$200,000 or more which was astronomical money back then. >> republicans and conservative it is don't believe in the amt, but they like to keep it around. when they had chrome of congress during the bush era, they could have gotten rid of it. they keep it around because it up happens to be a tax that falls more heavily on blue states. the amt basically doesn't allow you to deduct for things like your state income taxes and hits states with high property taxes and high income taxes hard, so you're talking california, connecticut, new york. >> it's like the obama donç or closet. >> and orrin hatch made that point this year, a republican senator. he said the amt hurts them more than us. >> they don't have to worry about it. they think that's their leverage. >> i want to think about other things discussed once we get past the tax rates, and i want to hear -- listen to president obama today talking about smflt other things, the spending cuts
that are involved and what they're dealing with here. >> i think there's a recognition that maybe they can accept some rate increases as long as it's combined with serious entitlement reform and additional spending cuts. if we can get the leadership on the republican side to take that framework, to acknowledge that reality, then the numbers actually aren't that far apart. another way of putting this is, we can probably solve this in about a week. it's not that tough. >> chris, there's the president saying he's ready to do serious entitlement reform and additional spending cuts, and no one seems to be noticing that. >> yeah. you know, i just talked about that. >> entitlement reform is medicare, medicaid and social security. >> that phrase, you would agree, right, the word "entitlement"
has bizarre see mantic resonance to it. like you're whiningç and entitled, social insurance. >> it was an honorable entitlement, but meaning i paid into social security for 30 years. i am entitled to my contributions coming back to me. >> it has a real resonance to take it away. that phrase morphed into something. and then entitlement reform. i think the big question when he talks about the numbers, right? you can take two different plans to cut $400 billion from medicare over ten years that have massively different implications for the structure of the program. you can find ways to say bulk negotiations for drug prices or raise the retirement age. what they mean for the social contract is radically different.
>> on medicaid, there isn't the room now. i mean, medicaid has been hacked over time, and the states will say, look, there isn't something you can cut from medicaid, and then you've got social security sitting over here, which is a massive pot that people get tempted to play with. there's this since of it doesn't belong in these negotiations. i don't hear the president specifying this is not ever going to be allowed here. the only thing i hear him the onlyhe ing i hear him income tax rates. >> that's true, that's the most important thing to him. you hear democrats saying that. democrats made it clear you will not pass cuts to the benefits in medicare through the senate. it will not get through the senate. i think there's an understanding that's not going to be done. republicans always go after these middle class sbimgtentitl or the amt that hit the modest
rich. they won't touch the top 2% for anything. >> we have to go. up with chris hayes airs saturdays and sunday mornings 8:00 to 10:00 a.m. eastern on msnbc. thank you both for joining me tonight. coming up, paul ryan is trying to save his ska rear by, of course, attacking mitt romney. what took him so long? and what holds higher among republicans? hillary clinton running for president or their states seceding from the union. it's a serious question, and i think you can guess the answer. that's coming up. there's big news. presenting androgel 1.62%. both are used to treat men with low testosterone. androgel 1.62% is from the makers of the number one prescribed testosterone replacement therapy. it raises your testosterone levels, and... is concentrated, so you could use less gel. and with androgel 1.62%,
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the permanent cause of this show is the k.i.n.d. fund, kids in need of desks that i created two years ago to provide desks in african classrooms where they've never seen desks. the k.i.n.d. operates year-round but we put a special emphasis on the season of giving. you have dwot our season of giving started this year with almost $80,000 in contributions which enables us to deliver 1200 desks to schools. the desks are made by workers to feed their families thanks to the valuable jobs they have making these desks. those 1200 desks will be used by 2 or 3 students at a time. the desks are designed to seat
two students, but they usually have three students squeezed onto this little bench. at least 3,000 students get to sit at desks for the first time in their lives simply because of the money you have donated in the past couple of days, and these desks, these desks will last for years, maybe five, maybe ten years. so the benefits of the money you contributed in the last couple of days will be felt by as many as 20,000 kids over the years, the useful years of these desks. since the time is)st told you about the k.i. n.d. fund two years ago, you have donated a total of $4.6 million to lift hundreds of thousands of kids in malawo off the floor and give them a better chance of learning in classrooms. because of the increase in costs of steel and wood in these desks and the skyrocketing costs of
fuel in malawi this year, the cost has gone up to $65 per desk. you can give $10 towards the cost of a desk. six other give $10 and get a desk built and delivered thanks to you. you can contribute at our website, which links to unicef's contribution forum. what you contribute is tax-deductible. it's a charitable gift. you can give a desk as a christmas or hanukkah present in their name. you can donate it and unicef will send a gift e-mail to whoever you want. i can never thank you enough for your generosity. it means a lot to me. the teachers that went to schools without desks thank you. they were the people who first told me how badly they needed desks in malawi, but no one can thank you better than the kids themselves. [ emily jo ] derrell comes into starbucks
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part of america could be written off. both parties tend to divide americans into our voters and their voters. let's be really clear. republicans must steer far clear of that trap. >> there's paul ryan realizing that his political future depends on him getting far away of mitt romney's insult to 47% of the american people. here is senator marco rubio last night at the same event. >> now, i've heard it suggested that the problem is that the american people have changed. that too many people want things from government. but i'm still convinced that the overwhelming majority of our people, they just want what my parents had, a chance. there are millions of mario rubios across america today. they are not looking for a handout. all they want is a job that provides for their families. >> one man is standing by mitt romney.
after listening to ryan and rubio's remarks, today rush limbaugh said this. >> one thing i will tell you is that what animated both these guys was romney's 47% comment. the republican party is running away from that. if the people of this country are not -- if a majority are not taught, educated, inspired, motivated to solve their own problems at least in part, nothing is going to change.ç the democratic party is always going to win. we are never going to come man deer the notion that we are the party of government. >> joining me now, msnbc political analyst e.j. dion and richard wolf. i'm so struck seeing paul ryan at the jack kemp dinner. i don't know how you can can idol i idolize rand and jack kemp. jack kemp saying, of course, we
don't forget about anyone or leave anyone behind, and ian rand says you leave behind anyone that can't fend for themselves. >> i think it's paul ryan trying now for at least a year to leave rand behind, and he's said -- he's tried to back away from all that. i think when you listen to both ryan and rubio today, this isn't like st. paul getting blinded by a new truth. these guys are practical politicians who saw the damage the 47% did and are changing their rhetoric. most of those speeches were standard conservatism. i think the fact they change the rhetoric is a really big deal. since ronald reagan it's been liberals that adjusted to conservative ideas. the beginning of that was bill clinton saying the era of big government is over. i think this is the first time in three decades where conservatives have been pushed
or forced by theç reality of politics and an election results to aadjust their ideas to the other side's ideas. they're running away from the idea that the only people who matter are those rich job creators, and they're running away from the idea that they can always just trash government. both of them spoke of the essential role of government. i think this is more important than it looks if you only write it off as rhetoric. >> i absolutely agree. i think it that point it's always been working the other way, democrats bending to republican rhetoric over the last few deck kuds is true. i want to look at how quickly this conversion is occurring in the republican world. let's lynn to paul ryan before the mitt romney backlash on the whole 47%. >> we can become a society where the net majority of americans are takers and not makers. the good news is survey after survey, poll after poll still
shows that we are a center-right 70/30 country. 70% of americans want the american dream. they believe in the american idea. only 30% want the welfare state. we risk hitting a tipping point in our society where we have more takers than makers in the society. where we will have turned our safety net into a hammock that lulls able-body people to lie in complacency, which drains them of will and incentive. >> moreç takers than makers in august of 2012. >> yeah. i'm sorry to put a dampener on this, but i'm not as optimistic about this change in rhetoric. if you looked at any number of focus groups and polls throughout the campaign, if you actually took the majority of mitt romney's language, he always talked about the middle class. they were looking at the same data. you want everyone to believe in the american dream and get on. the democrats want people to get
a handout. that's obviously a caricature, but when you look at what the policies actually are, when you look at how you create opportunity in the republican conservative mind, that actually is espoused by rubio and paul ryan, you're looking at a reduction of government investment and education funding. what they mean by more opportunity is more tax cuts for everyone. don't slice off the 2%. everyo deserves a tax cut. i'm a little less changes e anything more an sa y, wheard those fcus groups. maybe we didn't stick to the language of e focus groups all the me. maybe it was 47% of the time. >> e.j. >> in fact, i agree with the idea that they havt to aju just their policies this new rhetoric, although u kind of see it happen on the tax
of see it happen on the tax issue. out there and say, look, we want to raise more money from the rich, too. we just want to do it differently, maybe you're starting to see that their reading the focus groups goes not just to the rhetoric but to the need to start changing policies. as i was saying earlier, i think there's a cascading effect. when democrats in the '80s started -- when the democrats talked about the market, before too long they were voting to cut the capital gains tax. i think this takes time. they're not there yet. i think there's a logic -- rush limbaugh in an odd way i'm in agreement with. if they start down this road, they're going to have to go farther. this may begin to change conservatism. >> richard wolf and e.j. dion, thank you for joining me tonight. coming up, john kerry, susan rice or a republican?
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in the rewrite tonight, politics gangham style? >> you did okay. >> we got a lot of tweets about the pronunciation. when you say gangham the initial g is halfway between a g and k but don't aspirate the k. i don't know what that means. let's get the official, correct pronunciation from our digital producer. >> the first g is a hard g. >> give us the wrong pronunciation. >> everything is gangham. >> so wrong. >> you don't want to do it that way. >> the right way is? >> gangham style. >> done. >> okay. nancial obstacles military families face, we understand. at usaa, we know military life is different. we've been there. that's why every bit of financial advice we offer is geared specifically
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poll released today 48% of americans support marriage equality with 46% opposed. in our last presidential campaign year 2008, 55% of voters opposed same-sex marriage with only 36% supporting it. support for legalizing marijuana has now spread to a majority of american voters, 51% now favor the legalization of marijuana. 44% are opposed. public policy polling, which was the most accurate polling organization of the 2012 presidential campaign has released a post-election poll that shows republicans continue to rewrite reality. 49% of republican voters say that they think a.c.o.r.n. stole the election for president obama. the good news is that is a drop of 3 percentage points since 2008, when 52% of republicans thought that a.c.o.r.n. stole the election for president obama. the bad news is that a.c.o.r.n.
no longer exists, and so the 49% of republicans who still believe that a.c.o.r.n. stole this election for president obama are even more delusional than they were four years ago when the group thought they stole the election at least existed. some republicans are so bummed by the re-election of president obama that they don't want to live in america anymore.ç they also don't want to move. so 25% say they would like their state to secede from the union. only 56% of republicans want to remain americans. and 19% of republicans are still so dazed and confused they haven't been able to decide if they want to secede from the union. other republicans are making the saner choice of seceding from the party. in public policy polling's final poll before the election, they
found that 37% of voters identified themselves as republicans. their new post-election poll shows a sharp decrease with 32% identifying themselves as republicans which is to say identifying themselves as losers. voters identifying themselves as democrats increased by exactly the same amount as voters identifying themselves as republicans decreased. america hates losers, and apparently no one hates losers more than losers. the simpson-bowles proposal is not so much losing with the electorate as ignored by them. 60% don't have an opinion one way or another about simpson-bowles while 23% support it and 16% oppose it. with polling results like this, former republicanç senator ala simpson knows he has his work
cut out for him trying to convince congress to take government benefits away from people his age because alan simpson says that people his age like their government benefits, and, of course, there's the problem that alan simpson calls them old coots. so he has lost all hope of getting them to voluntarily give up their medicare and social security benefits, so he's now trying to convince young voters to take those benefits away from their grandparents. >> stop instagraming your breakfast and getting on youtube so you can see gangham style and start using those precious social media skills to go out and sign people up on this baby
three people a week and let it grow. take part or get taken part. the old coots will clean out the treasury before you get there. >> i have a bum knee. i'll do the lasso and horseback. the cowboys ride it. >> but the good news for the old dancing cowboy is çsimpson-bows does poll better than panetta-burns. a completely fictional budget proposal that the ppp included in their poll because ppp knows how to have fun. panetta-burns budget proposal does not exist is supported by 8% of voters and opposed by 17% of voters. unfortunately, we have no idea what these supporters of panetta-burns like about the budget proposal that does not exist or what the opponents hate
about the budget proposal that does not exist. if panetta-burns is going to have any chance of catching up to simpson-bowles, someone has it to teach panetta or burns how to dance gangham style. >> do you think you could show us how to do it? >> all right. >> all right. we've got some takers. >> you have to look up at the sky right side and then left leg kick your right leg. so it will be like this. turn on the music. one sh, two, three. ♪ >> one more time. >> sthafs bad. we'll see you in a few minutes.ç we're back in five right after this. price rewind. because your daughter really wants that pink castle thing.
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anything you want to share with us about your future or any other jobs out there? >> i have a bunch of meetings this afternoon, and i look forward to a terrific day. >> that was senator john kerry earlier today with andrea mitchell. not quite willing to discuss his future at this point. the obama administration could announce appointments to his national security team some time in the next two weeks. according to administration officials and john kerry's name obviously is floated for two positions, secretary of defense and secretary of state. joining john kerry on the short list to replace leon panetta at the pentagon is former republican senator chuck hagel who met with president obama at the white house this week. as for hillary clinton's position at the state department, the national journal
reports that president obama is, quote, genuinely conflicted over whether to pick kerry or united nations ambassador susan rice. president obama said yesterday that republican attacks against susan rice will not influence his decision. jo ari, what do you make of the chuck hagel situation with his name floating into the mix now? >> i thinkç it's a good faith efforts to take in a wide range of views. we know that president obama in his first term, obviously, went with secretary gates despite his ties to republican foreign policy. hagel is more of a progressive voice, but i'm not sure that a second-term obama presidency reaches back to another republican defense figure. >> and as to the john kerry/susan rice dilemma that the president faces, he says that the attacks on susan rice won't affect his decision one way or another.
it won't force his hand to nominate her, and it won't affect his decision to go with senator kerry, if that's what he chooses to do. is he going to be able to incredibly present his choice as his real first choice under these circumstances? >> well, that's the problem with this town, right? when you have these kind of vicious attacks you are damned if you do and damned if you don't. for cynical operators which i think there are some in the attacks on rice among the republican caucus here, they get a sort of partial short-term victory there because there is a lot of noise. i think at the end of the day this president gets his first choice, secretary of state nominee through regardless of which one it is. i've heard recently they do lean towards rice. wi we've talked about thatç befor. it goes to the desperation of the republicans. they're not focusing on anything legitimate regarding thect